For those of you just entering 1:8 scale racing. Just a little story about shock-fluids.
In the beginning of the 80's cars were equipped with small
shock absorbers 1/4 of the current size. The shock fluid used was normally a kind of transmission
oil.
These oils always changed in viscosity (thickness) during use and temperature
and a stable shock oil was not there. Therefore
all kinds of products were tried.
Even STP oil was used, you then
had to warm up your shocks before racing with a hair dryer before
you could use them.
Fortunenatly silicone oil was introduced in
the mid 80's. This type of oil has an better constant viscosity
over a wider temperature range then other fluids but still is not complete
temperature stable!
The thickness of the oil is officially
rated in Centi Stokes "Cts".
An other known and used American
rating is WEIGHT "WT".
This WT or W rating is a non world standard and is introduced by Associated and not comparable between brands
using this W or WT rating.
Thnaks to Casper who found this remark on the net about SAE WT:
"Correct measures of viscosity are centi-stokes,
N/m^2, or poises, depending on how you define it.
SAE WT is not really a measure of viscosity. The SAE scale was designed for
classifying motor oils. For example SAE 30/40 means that the viscoity is one
value (30) at one temperature and an equivalent (40) at the engine running
temperature. When the number has WT after it this meanns "winter" so that the
oil will have a particular value at I think 0 degrees Celsius.
The main problem with using the SAE scale oil is that each SAE band can
encompass a large variation in viscosity. For example one manufacturers SAE 5
can be anothers SAE 10 and both are within limits. Using the SAE scale oil is
best only to compare one manufacturer.
An other story about WT thanks to Frédéric De
Behr who found this on Wikipedia.
"Single-grade, or monograde motor oil
For single-grade oils, the kinematic viscosity is measured at a reference
temperature of 100°C (212°F) in units of mm˛/s or the equivalent older non-SI
units,
centistokes
(abbreviated cSt). Based on the range of viscosity the oil falls in at
that temperature, the oil is graded as an SAE number 0, 5, 10, 20, 30, 40, 50,
60 or 70. The higher the viscosity, the higher the SAE grade number is. These
numbers are often referred to as the weight of a motor oil. The reference
temperature is meant to approximate the operating temperature to which motor oil
is exposed in an engine"
So, clearly, "weight" is not a measure, just a chart, and the measure is the ISO
cP viscosity or cST dynamic viscosity (at specific temperatures !), then you
compare it to the SAE table. Some charts are referenced by Wikipedia.
Concerning Cts the thinner the oil (fluid) the
lower the number, the ticker the oil the higher the number.
For
normal shock absorber use, this rate may vary between 100 Cts until 900 Cts.
Nowadays we use O-ring sealed
differentials, so we can use silicone
oil in the differentials instead of thick grease.
For differentials the rate
may vary between 1.000 Cts (loose) up to even 500.000 Cts (very,
very, stiff).
Some USA based companies are still using the "WT"
weight rating, where Japanese and European companies use the better linear
industry standard Centi Stokes rating.
A lot off people think that the ratings between
the "WT" and "Cts" ratings are linear but this
isn't the case.
If there is a factory that can provide oil for testing we can arrange this to see if the product reaches the specification claimed or convert to Cts!
Which manufacturer use which rating?
Which manufacturers you can use same rating oil?
Only manufacturers using Cts as rating are using a world standard and can be
mixed used.
Other ratings like W and WT differ from brand from brand as WT or W is not a
world standard!
| shock oil | |||
| Brand | bottle values | label rating | linear values in Cts |
| Kyosho | 100 - 900 | numbers | yes |
| Mugen | 100 - 900 | numbers | yes |
| Associated | 10 - 80 | WT | no |
| Losi | 10 - 100 | WT | no |
| Orion | 10/100 - 80/800 | numbers | no |
| Xray | 100 - 900 | numbers | yes |
| GS-Racing USA | 20 - 60 | WT | no |
| GS-Racing Europe | 200 - 900 | Cts | yes |
| Crono | ? | ? | ? |
| Serpent | 20 - 50 | W | no |
| Thunder Tiger | ? | ? | ? |
| Trinity | ? | ? | ? |
| differential oil | |||
| Brand | bottle values | label rating | linear values in Cts |
| Kyosho | 1.000 - 60.000 | numbers | yes |
| Mugen | 1.000 - 60.000 | numbers | yes |
| Associated | not available | not available | not available |
| Losi | not available | not available | not available |
| Orion | not available | not available | not available |
| Xray | 1.000 - 60.000 | numbers | yes |
| GS-Racing USA | 1.000 - 50.000 | Centipoise Cts | yes |
| GS-Racing Europe | 1.000 - 50.000 | Centipoise Cts | yes |
| Crono | ? | ? | ? |
| Serpent | not available | not available | not available |
| Thunder Tiger | ? | ? | ? |
| Trinity | not available | not available | not available |
If you have better information let us know
For shock absorber use, this is the comparison table when using LOSI, ASSOCIATED and SERPENT some others silicone oil rated in "WT" "W" or are not labeled with a rating but just a number like 30/300
| unofficial conversion values provided by Gene Hickerson USA | ||
| Cts | Losi WT | Associated WT |
| 100 | 10 | 7.5 |
| 150 | 15 | 12.5 |
| 200 | 20 | 17.5 |
| 275 | 25 | 22.5 |
| 300 | 27.5 | 25 |
| 350 | 30 | 27.5 |
| 400 | 32.5 | 30 |
| 425 | 35 | 32.5 |
| 450 | 37.5 | 35 |
| 500 | 40 | 37.5 |
The 50 Cts steps between "Cts" rating are linear, where
the 5 "WT" steps used in the "WT" rating are progressive
compared to the real thickness of the oil.
No one can tell TEAM TWF8 how "WT" OR "W" rating is measured!!!!! If you know it let us
know! info@twf8.ws
| Serpent oil (04-01-2005) | |
| rating W | Cts |
|
20 |
107 |
| 25 | 207 |
| 30 | 370 |
| 35 | 626 |
| 40 | 1070 |
| 45 | 1449 |
| 50 | 2250 |
We tested this oil supplied by Serpent
Benelux on 04-01-2005 in our labaratory and compared them with a
calibration oil.of 100 Cts.
Conclusion:
Serpent oil is
way of linear with Cts rating
|
Xray silicone oil with Rheometer |
|
| Rating | Cts |
| 100 | 106 |
| 150 | 179 |
| 200 | 248 |
| 250 | 292 |
| 300 | 354 |
| 350 | 381 |
| 400 | 441 |
| 450 | 475 |
| 500 | 542 |
| 600 | 625 |
| 700 | 702 |
| 800 | 799 |
| 900 | 913 |
| 1.000 | 1020 |
| Differential usage | |
| 2.000 | 2490 |
| 3.000 | 4270 |
| 5.000 | 9000 |
| 7.000 | 10500 |
| 10.000 | 13000 |
| 20.000 | 30000 |
| 30.000 | 39600 |
| 60.000 | 65000 |
Use the values above for your benefit and as a
guideline.
Xray oil provided by TEAM Xray Slovakia
|
Kyosho |
|
| rating | Cts |
| 250 | 244 |
| 300 | 302 |
| 350 | 351 |
| 400 | 411 |
| 500 | 506 |
Use the values above for your benefit and as a guideline.
| Associated silicone oil
measured with Rheometer 09-10-2005 |
|
| rating WT | Cts |
| 10 | 108 |
| 15 | --* |
| 20 | 208 |
| 25 | 286 |
| 30 | 373 |
| 35 | 454 |
| 40 | 525 |
| 50 | 707 |
| 60 | 725 |
| 70 | 960 |
| 80 | 1040 |
Use the values above for your benefit and as a
guideline.
* The value 15 Weights we measured was like water thickness and is probably a
filling fault at the factory.
Altough the contents was silicone oil it was to thin for the 15 WT spects and can
not be used for the shocks.
Associated oils were provided by Kendall Bennet from A-mainhobbies
and Tony Penzincka from Tony
Screws
| Trinity silicone oil
measured with Rheometer 09-10-2005 |
|
| rating | Cts |
| 30 | 337 |
| 35 | 376 |
| 40 | 505 |
| 45 | 497 |
| 50 | 658 |
| 55 | 568 |
| 60 | 799 |
| 70 | 757 |
| 90 | 974 |
Use the values above for your benefit and as a
guideline.
Trinity oils were provided by Kendall Bennet from A-mainhobbies
and Tony Penzincka from Tony
Screws
| Losi
silicone oil measured with Rheometer 15-12-2005 |
|
| rating | Cts |
| 15 | 110 |
| 17.5 | 158 |
| 20 | 243 |
| 22.5 | 243 |
| 25 | 294 |
| 27.5 | 345 |
| 30 | 381 |
| 32.5 | 397 |
| 35 | 459 |
| 37.5 | 477 |
| 40 | 546 |
| 45 | 657 |
| 50 | 886 |
| 60 | 844 |
| 70 | 970 |
Use the values above for your benefit and as
a guideline.
Losi oils were provided byVolker Gerdes from BUGGY-SPORT.INFO
The only and correct way to measure fluid thickness or to say viscosity is to measure the flow of fluid itself in certain time trough a hole. Simple!
So we do not weigh the weight of the oil as this is a standard value that does not change when the viscosity changes!
![]() |
A special calibrated measuring device called "Ubbelohde" is a U-tube that contains a certain amount of fluid (in our case the silicone oil). The diameter of the tube and the diameter of the hole where fluid goes through is always constant and calibrated. The thicker the fluid the longer it takes to get a certain amount through. The time the passing of the fluid takes and the known diameter of the hole can produce the figures we need called viscosity.
How does the measurement works?
A vacuum sucks the oil that is in the bottom of the tube up into the
front tube. As soon as the top fluid level of the fluid has passed the top
(HIGH) sensor the vacuum drops automatically and the oil starts to
flow back. A timer is started automatically. As soon as the the fluid level passes
the other sensor (LOW) the time counting is stopped! The time it takes for the
level to go from the high to the low sensor is the time we need to calculate the
viscosity of the fluid.
As we know the amount of oil, the time it takes and the diameter of the
calibrated hole we can calculate the viscosity in mm˛/s. Then we
have the viscosity in Centistokes value.
Centi Poise (nowadays called Pascal per second) is the result of the Centistokes value
magnified with the density of the oil.
Normally for silicone oil this value is 0.9875 = almost 1.0
To perform the whole measurement accurate and constant we have
to calibrate the whole system first. Normally this is done when
the tube is placed in a water bath that is keeping the whole
measurement set up on same temperature @ 22 degrees Celsius for the whole measurement. A calibration fluid is used to check if the
reading is correct or need to be adjusted before the real
measurement takes place.
Then the tested oil is placed into the tube and the test is
performed. As not all oils are the same in viscosity, there are
different tubes with a calibrated hole to get the appropriate and
corresponding readings.
From September 2006 we measure all oils with a RHEOMETER.
SILICONE SHOCK OIL AND TEMPERATURE
Although everybody thinks silicone oil is not affected by
temperature, we can wake you up out of that dream.
When the
same test is done @ 12 or @ 32 degrees Celsius we get other values!
Test result from our laboratory provid us with the following fist rule:
When temperature is 10 degrees Celsius lower or higher the viscosity decreases or increases by 5%. Example:
200Cts @ 12 degrees Celsius
is 210 Cts
200Cts @ 22 degrees Celsius is 200 Cts
200Cts @ 32 degrees Celsius is 190 Cts
| Silicone shock oil measured in Centistokes at various temprature in Degrees Celsius | |||
| Shock oil temperature | Losi 40 | Trinity 40 | Associated 40 |
| 5 | 754 | 688 | 747 |
| 10 | 677 | 622 | 685 |
| 15 | 605 | 555 | 598 |
| 20 | 539 | 492 | 536 |
| 25 | 501 | 467 | 502 |
| 30 | 455 | 420 | 456 |
| 35 | 409 | 377 | 410 |
| 40 | 373 | 345 | 375 |
| 45 | 345 | 320 | 346 |
| 50 | 319 | 294 | 319 |
![]() |
|---|
| Xceed RC just released a full range of silicone oils for use in geardiffs and shocks. High quality lab-checked and verified silicone oil. Packed in 50ml easy squeezable bottles, with special top for precision filling of shocks and diffs. Available now, range 300cst up to 200.000cst in total 13 grades. |
![]() |
||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| TWF8 inhouse chemical analist, Jacco Koch, tested the consistency of the total range. | ![]() |
||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
![]() |
||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
![]() |
| Ultimate rc shock oil |
|---|
| Ultimate Racing brand was created in 1999 by Modelix Racing with the main goal in mind of offering high quality alternatives and solutions to the 1/8th nitro racers, with the advantage that has been designed by experienced racers. After a few years, Ultimate Racing has become a brand synonymous with racing in the 1/8th scale nitro market. The distinctive feature of the Ultimate Racing products is that have been designed with both professional racers and beginners in mind, so the result is a wide range of high competition products that can also be easily used by beginners. |
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
|
![]() |
||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Team TWF8 special thanks goes to Jacco Koch our Chemicals specialist from The Netherlands for testing the fluids and the pictures.
Click here and see how to mix your silicone shock and diff oils in the right percentages.